The Mystery Of The World Beyond
United Nations, New York June 26,1992.
Page 6Q. Hi. I see so much destruction going on around me,environmental destruction.
M.True.
Q. Cruelty. Cruelty to animals.
M.It's true.
Q. I just wonder how You perceive this and what Youcan recommend to people who are trying to release themselves fromthis world in the spiritual fashion, to help them cope with theirsurroundings and cope with all the devastation that is going onaround them. And do You think that going beyond this world isenough for us to recognize what we are leaving behind, or do Youfeel we in this plane have a duty to try to alleviate the suffering?And will it do any good?
M.It will. It will. At least for us, for our conscience so thatwe feel we are doing something and we have tried our best to relievethe suffering of our fellow beings. I do all the same. Whateveryou ask, I am doing. I did, I do, and I will. I have told youalready, our finances are distributed to different organizations,sometimes, or different countries, when there are in disasters.And I would not like to boast much about it, but since you ask...And for example, we gave one million dollars US to Philippineslast year for their release of their... relief of their Mt. Pinatubo.And we helped the flood victims in Vietnam, and the flood victimsin China etc. And we are trying to help the Vietnamese refugeesnow to release...to.... to help with the U.N.'s burden, you understand,provided the U.N. wants us to help. But we are trying. Yes, understandnow? We help them with financial support, and also we could relocatethem if the U.N. lets it happen - with the blessing of the U.N.Understand? Yes, so we do all these things that you have requestedand also because, since we are here, you understand, we mightjust as well clean our environment as much as possible. Therefore,we help with the suffering and we help with the moral standardof the world. Yeah? Both spiritually and physically. Yes. Becausesome people don't want to take spirituality from me. They onlywant to take physical help. So we help them physically. And that'swhat we do, that's why I have to earn money. That's why I don'twant to live on people's donations. Understand? All my monks andmy disciples have to work, just like you do. And then, apart fromthat, we help spiritually also, understand, and help with thesuffering of the world, help to relieve the suffering of the world.We have to do this. Doesn't mean we sit in samadhi all day longand enjoy ourselves. That's a very selfish Buddha (enlightenedbeing). We don't want to have him here. (laughter)
Q. I just have one more question. I was wondering ifYou knew anything... I heard many reports that the Dali Lama eatsmeat and I was just wondering if You knew if that was true andhow he would excuse that.
M.I don't know why you asked me, you have to ask him.
Q. I just wondered if You had heard it or if You knewanything about that.
M.You see I very much not like to talk other people things, especiallywhen that person is not here to defend himself; should thingsnot be the way we understood. All right, please excuse. He isa lovable person as far as he can be. And anything else is hisown responsibility and choice of life.
Q. Thank You Master Ching Hai, for having the patiencewith us today, [Master: It's okay] for answering our questionsand being so generous. You spoke about a level where one is awarethat they have powers that come from that awareness. Now whatif you are aware of the powers, you don't know that you have thembut you are aware of them. You may even feel like you do. Howdo you access it or not access it? If you don't access it, howdo you not become impatient with the process that's going on around?Like you see the process taking a slow, mundane way when you knowyou can just pray or do something else to bring about a betteror quicker resolution.
M.Yeah, understand.
Q. What does that mean and how does one access it withthe blessing that it will come out okay? Do you understand whatI mean?
M.I understand, I understand. What you meant is that when we havethe power to change things and when the things around go in abureaucratic way and a slow way, how would you have the patienceto bear it, right? Or would you just pray or do some magic orpoint a finger and push it, right? No, I have patience becausewe have to work with the pace of this world in order not to bringit into chaos. Yes. For example, a child cannot run. Not becauseyou are in a hurry or you want to run that you make the childstumble and fall. So we have to be patient. Even though we havethe power to run, we walk with the child, yes. That's why sometimesI am also frustrated and impatient but I have to teach myselfto be patient. That's why I have to go and bow my head from onepresident after another for the refugees, even though we wantto add all the financial support. We would give all we have, everything,millions of dollars, or billions even. We have to go through thebureaucratic system. Give Caesar what belongs to Caesar. Understand?I am not going to wield my head or to point a finger at the U.N.even make them run. No, no. We cause disaster in this world ifwe use physical, magic power. Understand? It has to go the wayit goes. But we can elevate people's consciousness by spiritualhealing, by spiritual wisdom, understanding. Impart to them theknowledge that they are willing to do it, you understand, andcooperate. That's the best way, not to use magical power. I neverintentionally use magical power in any aspect of life. But miraclesjust happen around the spiritual practitioners. That's very natural,but not intentionally. You understand? Not trying to push things.Yes, that's no good. The child cannot run. All right? You satisfiedwith my answer? If any of my answers don't suit you, please letme know, because I can explain further. But I trust you are veryintelligent, being the most chosen and intelligent people of allnations. Therefore I don't elaborate very much, yeah. Any morequestion? Yes, behind there. It's good that we have United Nations,I have to say, by the way. Yes, yes. We eliminate many of theworld's conflicts and wars, even though we cannot completely minimize.But I read your books of United Nations. Everyone is United Nations.And I have followed some of the United Nations work. And I mustpraise its effort and efficiency in rescuing hostages where otherpeople cannot rescue, all the power of the world cannot rescueand one United Nations' commissioner did it.
Yes, and many other things concerning disasterrelief, refugee problems. You have about twelve million refugees,I heard, responsibility. No? It's a lot of work, and the warsand everything. So it's good that we have United Nations, yeah!It's very good.
Q. Thank You, Master Ching Hai, for sharing Your wisdomwith us. I have a question. It's about the escalating world populationand its accompanying problem of further environmental abuse andthe further greater demand for food. Would You like to commentsomething on this escalating world population? Is this a worldkarma? Or is this going to create certain kind of karma in thefuture?
M.Ummm, to have more people for this world is also very good. Whynot? More crowded, more noise, more fun. No? It's not that weare overpopulated, really. We just not spread out evenly. Peoplejust condense in certain areas of the world and do not want tomove to another area. That is all. Yeah, we have so many vastareas of wild land that have not been used. Many virgin islands,many vast.. you know, plateaus which are only green with forestsand nothing there. Ummm, people just like to concentrate in NewYork, for example (Laughter) because it's more fun here. Yes,because if a government or any government is able to create jobs,you understand, and industry... and employment of different kindsin different places and people would go there also to work. Theyjust condense in some places because it's easier to find employmenthere, or safety. If the safety, security and employment opportunitypresents itself in those other different places, people wouldgo there also. They would go for security, for their livelihood.That's very natural. Yeah? So, it's not that we should fear aboutoverpopulation. We should be more organized to give people ofthe world more benefit of employment opportunities and housingand security. Then everywhere is the same. We would never be overpopulated.And about your question concerning food, you should know better.Because in America, we have so much information concerning howto preserve the world. Vegetarian diet is one of the best, topreserve the world's resources, to feed the whole population ofthe earth. Because we waste a lot of vegetarian food, energy,electricity, medicine, to raise animals. Understand? Whereby itcould feed other people directly. And many countries of the thirdworld nations, they sell their protein-enriched vegetarian foodfor cheaper price. But that is not a help to the other world nations'populations. If we spread all the food evenly and vegetarian dietwill help this, not only for ourselves, not only for the animals,but for the whole world. One of the research something... magazines,they already said that if want... if everyone in the... how tosay... Oh, last time, I was in United Nations, I mentioned thatalready. I've forgotten. If we eat vegetarian, the world willnot be hungry anymore. And also we have to organize, yeah, organize.I know some person, he can make rice bran into nutritious foodand milk even. And we have talked last time about that. He saidhe spend about three hundred thousand dollars and he can feedsix hundred thousand people in Ceylon - the poor, the under-nourished,the mothers, and all that. Yeah, it was fantastic. Because theway we do it in many parts of the world, it's that we waste thenatural resources, not that we don't have enough. God wouldn'tput us here to starve. Actually, we starve ourselves. So we haveto rethink... rethink, reorganize, and that needs the blessingof many countries' governments. They have to bless us with theirabsolute honesty, cleanliness and, you understand, dignity, andthe will to serve people instead of serve themselves. If we havethis blessing from all the countries' governments, you understand,we have no problem really. No problem. We have to have good leadership,good economic organization and ruling talents and honest governments.But that can come about more rapidly when many people or mostof the people or all the people become spiritual. Then they knowthe discipline. Then they know the precepts. Then they know howto be honest and clean. And they know how to use their wisdomthen. Then they can think of many things to do and reorganizeour lives. Understand? Otherwise if you just run for power withyour pocket money or with the money collected from the publicand then you try to collect the same money again before you runout of power then. Does not help at all. Does not matter if yousit on gold mine, we die all the same of poverty. The leadersof many nations have to be aware of their power and responsibility.Have to think of the people, reorganize the system. Uh! Yes.
Q. That seems to be very difficult because as I see,much of the... as I understand, much of the environmental abusetoday has to do with a growing population's demand for more livingspace, for homes, for living the way we in the 20th century knowand want to live. Say the jungles in Brazil. The environmentalabuse there. The destruction of the forest there, the rain forest.The land, it's being defoliated and that results in floods. Andthese are not unrelated to the problem of overpopulation.
M.Yes, everything is related to each other, of course, in this world.And the only solution is to solve it from the root, not the branches.And the root is spiritual stability. Understand? So all we haveto do is to try to spread the spiritual message, what we know,and keep to the spiritual discipline. That's what people don'thave. It's okay to plug yourself in the electric machine and havesome lights and some buzzing music and get samadhi. But if youdon't have moral discipline, then you only use the power for badthings sometimes. Can't control it. You understand? That's whywe in this group, we keep... teach people the precepts first.Precepts are important. We have to know where we go and maneuverour power. Power without love, without compassion, without properunderstanding of the moral value, then it's no use. It becomesblack magic, abuse. Yeah. That's where black magic comes from.Understand? So it's easy to get enlightenment, it's hard to keepit. In our path, if you are not truly disciplined and morallyequipped, the master will take away some of your power so thatyou cannot abuse it and do bad things to the society. Understand?That's the difference. Master has control. The master power, themaster power, okay? Yes, I am very happy with all of your intelligentquestions. Very intelligent. People do these things because theyare not wise enough, you know, like abusing the land that youhave said, or doing something just because their lack of wisdom.Yes, so the root is wisdom, spiritual practice. Get enlightened.Yes man.
Q. I've read a couple of Your books and I've listenedto several of Your tapes.
M.You have! Amazing! So we knew each other then.
Q. I am intrigued by the concept of asuras.
M.A..S..U..R..A..S...What is that? Asura! Asura! Ah, astral! Ah,asuras! Yes, yes, yes. This is the Sanskrit language for astralentities, astral entities. Okay now. I didn't know you speak inthe Sanskrit. Right so!
Q. So my question is that I know that I struggle todo the right thing to do my practices and I know that I am strugglingagainst something that is struggling against me. And my questionis how do I get beyond the struggle? How do I win?
M.That's where fun is. If something is too easy, you know you losethe challenge and you don't even want to win it. Yes. Therefore,we have two powers inside us. We call "yin and yang"in Oriental terms, and Chinese. Uh. We call negative and positivein the western terminology. Negative power just pushes us to dosomething which is against our will, and positive power helpsus to conquer that tendency. And sometimes we lose, sometimeswe win, depends on our spiritual discipline and power. So tryto struggle and continue. Just like the United Nations strugglewith refugees issues and the wars in the world. Sometime you winat the end, it takes some struggling. I thank you for your attention.All the best.
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